Book Interview: Fearing the Black Body - The Racial Origins of Fat-Phobia.

[John Smith]

Posted by Elfcat on ana another forum yesterday:

"This afternoon, Jovelyn Richards, one of the rotating hosts of KPFA's book program Cover to Cover, had a delightful half-hour interview with author Sabrina Springs on her new book, Fearing the Black Body: The Racial Origins of Fat-Phobia. The thesis is that white American women were subjected to pressure to be "disciplined" in their behavior with stereotypes which associated round-bodiedness and excessive appetites with the supposed primitiveness of non-white and particularly African women. The pressure was eventually so effective, and white American women were so emaciatign themselves, that ironically the cereal maker Kellogg then tried to encourage them to gain weight back, fearing that too many white women would be unable to bear children and would trigger the much-feared "white genocide"."

https://kpfa.org/episode/cover-to-cover-open-book-may-29-2019/

[John Smith]

I've always tell it, anyone.

[John Smith]

@>_< 0_0

[>_< 0_0]

🤔 I have not read this book, but I have noticed that African Americans are distinctly lighter than African Africans. That means there were lots of racial mixing. There’s all kinds of that, but two examples stick in my mind, one being a black indentured servant from the 1600’s that married her former master after she was freed and won a court case in Virginia guaranteeing the freedom of her children. The other example was some plantation owner that wrote all his sins in a library (he bedded dozens of his slaves and would pray for forgiveness off and on again).

But that’s all a big tangent! Sorry, I’m a history major 😬 Anyway, my slim readings on the subject of racial relations don’t seem to indicate that there’s any fear of thicc African girls 🤔 I need to read this book you found. I don’t think it’s at my local bookstore tho

[John Smith]

3 hours ago, >_< 0_0 said:

🤔 I have not read this book, but I have noticed that African Americans are distinctly lighter than African Africans. That means there were lots of racial mixing.

Actually, indigenous African populations - or "Africans Africans" - forms the most both genetically ans ethnically diverse population of the world: which renders very difficult from my opinion to figure out by what do you meant by there since this same diversity had stem the most extensive variety of skin tones. Been also the cradle of humankind and wellspring from most of the oldest organizing urban societies ever, its significant millenia-spanning influence has drawn various populations from many horizons, who ended up to assimilate themselves more-or-less to the native masses: even prior to that, the many out-of-Africa migrations during prehistory more-or-less ended up to get back to the continent, fostering more diversity.

We found as many, let alone perhaps much varieties of tones in the African continent alone than amid his African American diaspora. But yea, genetic studies alike historiographical database confirms the presence of some mixed ancestry amongst them. About 16.7%–24% of the African American community have European ancestry, due chiefly to miscegenatory marriages and mostly sexual abuse by white slavemasters during the colonial era, whilst about 1% have Native American ancestry and the patterns varies from country to country.

Quote

There’s all kinds of that, but two examples stick in my mind, one being a black indentured servant from the 1600’s that married her former master after she was freed and won a court case in Virginia guaranteeing the freedom of her children. The other example was some plantation owner that wrote all his sins in a library (he bedded dozens of his slaves and would pray for forgiveness off and on again).

But that’s all a big tangent! Sorry, I’m a history major 😬 Anyway, my slim readings on the subject of racial relations don’t seem to indicate that there’s any fear of thicc African girls 🤔 I need to read this book you found. I don’t think it’s at my local bookstore tho

From my experience, I noticed that noxious preconceptions about above-average-weight-to-fuller female bodies amid a fewer Western countries partly underpins from what I could describe as a latent racial anxiety: American society been the most and leastly saddest eloquent example to that social phenomenon. 

There have a prevalent tendency by the American popular culture to mindlessly associate all the negative stereotypes of obesity as self-fulfilling symbol of laziness, greed, hedonism & unrestrained lack of self-control to either the lower social-economical classes or the marginalized groups, classes and groups that include notwithstanding a substantial amount of the impevorished black American population... when you scroll up for a fat joke or meme on your engine search drive, chances that you'd fell on pictures about some gowdy, dark-skinned grown women chugging a bucket of fried chicken, a personable black man trying to roll his arm onto the 60-inch wide absence of waistline from some unattractive, elephantine blonde or about how Lil Wayne no longer longing to "eat booty" just below the picture of the massive-reared Mikel Ruffinelli or anything of this kind are pretty high. When you think about the quintessence of the Fat Trope in Hollywood, you intiuitively think about Eddie Murphy films and their consistent rant about fat black women. When white folks think about the Kardashians or the "Big Booty Era" , they automatically assume that these latter ones "ethnicized" white beauty standards. When Ashley Graham is around, no one cannot ignore that hint of Midwest black accent popping up once and a while in her voice, nor about the color skin of her husband, her "exotic looks" or her nigh career-killing fixation for Jason Momoa's Haka dance moves (fyi: there aren't such thing like a Haka dance) . 

If the cultivation of a plain-figured body in Western society has been empowered by the body positivity movement - coupled by a silly mass-spread herd-minded obsession for some peculiar TV reality celebrities and one former pornstar - to the point to be somehow "appropriated" out of its racialized context, we cannot ignore the core element of Fatness meaning everything of unattractive, sinful, uncivilized and degenerate to the post-industrial modern society... society deeply rooted into the past shadowy practises of Colonialism, slavery, orthodox patriarchy and miscegenation. After all, that wasn't long ago that having a fat derriere and a set of very flaring hips while being a woman regardless her ethnic background, were subjected to slut-shaming and being vitupered a le ghty banter bordering on the colonial imagery of southern populations as subhuman species most closer to the Ape than Man.

Even here on Curvage, we may assist every once and a while to such enpirical sample of the said mechanism, whenever any heated commentary about non-black-nor-Hispanic fuller-figured women endowed by larger-than-nature lower half bodies are popping out. A few years ago, somebody was bickering in a very oblivious manner about Love Randalin been the spawn from some yet undiscovered mutated posthuman subspecies as to him, that was simply impossible she may been Caucasian before to snap when I replied him that she's simply have Lipoedema and that her condition has nothing to do about whatever pseudosientific blabbering he was talking about. Not so long ago, somebody did the same on my Karina Irby thread, speculating elusively about the goverment putting oestrogens into water to ethnicize Caucasian women and chemically castrate men. One week ago, somebody posted a meme about a black woman eating fried chicken on the Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez thread.

These biases are well extant within society.

[Guest pang]

That book sounds really interesting and is definitely something I'd like to read.

As this applies to the feedism/weight gain fetishism, stereotypes and assumptions about race and weight is part of why black women aren't as present in the community. Around here, people tend not to get as excited about a black woman gaining weight because, well, we expect black women to be big. A black girl getting fat is just confirming our assumptions and living up to the standard. A white woman getting fat, however, is seen as more indulgent, sinful, letting go of or in opposition to cultural standards. Almost anyone here knows that the "naughty" aspect of gaining weight is a huge appeal for both gainers and feeders. Delighting in ones fat bodies is sensual and improper.

I'm certainly guilty of these racial-weight prejudices and fetishizing. For example, I fetishize Asian weight gain more than others largely because when I was growing up Asian and skinny were synonymous. But in recent years, as the obesity rate among Asians begins to balloon, I'm very excited to see a  group of women who have traditionally always been skinny and expected to be skinny becoming fat in a very "non-Asian" way.

At the same time, black communities have accepted and celebrated size for longer and to a greater extent than white and Asian cultures. It is shifting now, though, as different communities and cultures are coming to accept and appreciate heavier bodies to a much greater extent.

[John Smith]

Absolutely.

This is, for a matter of point, really regretful to realize at which point black feedees and gainers are pretty unconsodered by most Fat Admiration centered web-communities, especially when we notice that some colourstruck Feedist subculture is predominant within these same groups.

Counterproductively speaking, one black feedee who may pass as either racially ambiguous, so-calledly "Caucasian-looking" or very light-skinned had most chances to enjoy some popularity here than the darker-skinned or the so-called "racy" ones: this trend does applies even in the Plus Size fashion industry and varies in depends to one's group proficiency to unfavor more-or-less non-hourglass-or-pear shaped women. We hear a lot about the King Stephs, ChubbyCows, SSBBW Briannas, Bree Kish (I think most people haven't even realized yet she's actually biracial) or Tabria Majors. Much less about the rest of the black models whatsoever.

[>_< 0_0]

You sure you aren’t reading into it too much? I’m extremely attracted to black girls and none the white people around me ever said they don’t look hot (except my Dad; he said their hair is “messy”). I think the reason there aren’t many black girls on Curvage is because of three reasons, the first being that most western nations have very few blacks (most members here are from Western nations), so in total, I’d guess if the black/white ratio is, say, 10 to 1, there should be about 10 white curvage models for every black one. The second thing is a cultural one. When white girls gain, they usually find a site like this eventually. When black girls gain, they usually are advertising apetamin on YouTube (I’ve seen it!). The third reason is more of an alternate argument against this book’s thesis: big black girls are almost always way hotter than big white girls (in the eyes of average people) because most white girls are “apples” and most black girls are “pears,” so gaining on purpose isn’t something most white girls would do on purpose.

[John Smith]

@>_< 0_0 There have actually quite a noteworthy lot of African American women and other women of African descent from Western and most peculiarily Latin America countries who adheres more-and-more to Fat fetishism, Plus Size dating apps and one peculiar Fat Admiration centered social media these past few years, whilst at least four of the most prominent Fat Fetishism webmodels outside Curvage are black.

I have to disagree on this point. Most black women who adhered here get at last underserved, simply because as @pang said, the trend is simply not in their favor and that partly because of the latent race stereotypes.

[Chevalier]

Sometimes it's a fetish like yellow fever or racist porn, and of course Asian countries with skin whiteners still being used. Wouldn't blame the white man on fatness lol though given the ever growing obesity levels, and of course overcompensation to be 1D FAT. That's why there was such a backlash for Amanda Waller being thin. Some even calling her the rail in those comics.

Guess they wanted the wall to be in Batman's weight class.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/gen-discussion-1/anyone-else-not-liking-skinny-amanda-waller-1512876/&ved=2ahUKEwiy46yt38biAhWjTN8KHTsbDSUQFjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw2ihygKRWzZ8uvXDxwB7rfi

But hey be like pornhub and choose ebony to celebrate Martin Luther King Day lol

[Guest high]

The past 25 years have provided an ever-increasing flow of sh#t from academia. I'm not entertaining this author's paranoia.

[John Smith]

1 hour ago, high said:

The past 25 years have provided an ever-increasing flow of sh#t from academia. I'm not entertaining this author's paranoia.

Can you elaborate?

[tw71]

On 5/31/2019 at 5:04 PM, >_< 0_0 said:

I'm thinking along the same lines, I guess.  As a white guy, I was digging the "super large booty" ladies, whatever race they happened to be, from the time I first realized I liked the opposite sex.  That was way before the Kardashians were even heard of!  And for just as long, I found "thunder thighs" super attractive. The only frustration I had (and really, still have) is that so many women find them a negative. In fact, what i often found was that women would complain about their "huge legs" and they weren't even really that big!  I was disappointed seeing them because with their talk/complaints, I was expecting more!

As I got older, I started noticing that #1, more black girls were likely to dress attractively and show off a little bit of skin, when they were heavier/curvier, and #2, extra weight just looked more appealing to me on someone with darker skin. So I started focusing more on them for dating.  The cultural differences that cause more white women to feel that dieting and staying skinny is so desirable are norms I find unappealing - whatever their origins really were.

 

You sure you aren’t reading into it too much? I’m extremely attracted to black girls and none the white people around me ever said they don’t look hot (except my Dad; he said their hair is “messy”). I think the reason there aren’t many black girls on Curvage is because of three reasons, the first being that most western nations have very few blacks (most members here are from Western nations), so in total, I’d guess if the black/white ratio is, say, 10 to 1, there should be about 10 white curvage models for every black one. The second thing is a cultural one. When white girls gain, they usually find a site like this eventually. When black girls gain, they usually are advertising apetamin on YouTube (I’ve seen it!). The third reason is more of an alternate argument against this book’s thesis: big black girls are almost always way hotter than big white girls (in the eyes of average people) because most white girls are “apples” and most black girls are “pears,” so gaining on purpose isn’t something most white girls would do on purpose.

 

[John Smith]

On 5/31/2019 at 5:04 PM, >_< 0_0 said:

You sure you aren’t reading into it too much? I’m extremely attracted to black girls and none the white people around me ever said they don’t look hot (except my Dad; he said their hair is “messy”). I think the reason there aren’t many black girls on Curvage is because of three reasons, the first being that most western nations have very few blacks (most members here are from Western nations), so in total, I’d guess if the black/white ratio is, say, 10 to 1, there should be about 10 white curvage models for every black one. The second thing is a cultural one. When white girls gain, they usually find a site like this eventually. When black girls gain, they usually are advertising apetamin on YouTube (I’ve seen it!). The third reason is more of an alternate argument against this book’s thesis: big black girls are almost always way hotter than big white girls (in the eyes of average people) because most white girls are “apples” and most black girls are “pears,” so gaining on purpose isn’t something most white girls would do on purpose.

This is actually wrong. There have much women dwelling into hotter climates who tend to develop a pear shape: the only thing you'd forget to mention is that there have plenty of different ethnicities and phenotypes living under hotter climates. Go to Southern Europe or the Middle East and you'll find plenty of women shaped like this without necessarily being ethnically Africans. 

 

Be careful to not stumble onto easily assumed racial preconceptions, guys.

[>_< 0_0]

10 minutes ago, John Smith said:

This is actually wrong. There have much women dwelling into hotter climates who tend to develop a pear shape: the only thing you'd forget to mention is that there have plenty of different ethnicities and phenotypes living under hotter climates. Go to Southern Europe or the Middle East and you'll find plenty of women shaped like this without necessarily being ethnically Africans. 

 

Be careful to not stumble onto easily assumed racial preconceptions, guys.

But I never mentioned hotter climates or Africa?

[John Smith]

12 minutes ago, >_< 0_0 said:

But I never mentioned hotter climates or Africa?

Well, you've said black women tend to be more pear-shaped than white women. I just wanted to point out an accurate mention that most female populations originate from hotter climates tend to be bottom-heavy/large-hipped because of climatic determinism.

[>_< 0_0]

1 hour ago, John Smith said:

Well, you've said black women tend to be more pear-shaped than white women. I just wanted to point out an accurate mention that most female populations originate from hotter climates tend to be bottom-heavy/large-hipped because of climatic determinism.

They do? I thought it was lucky genes

[John Smith]

4 minutes ago, >_< 0_0 said:

They do? I thought it was lucky genes

Yes and no. Human buttocks serves as a body heat regulator, then populations who lives into hotter climates tend to resultingly favor a natural proficiency in larger buttocks to better cool down, whilst populations living in colder latitudes tend to be mostly apple-shaped.

[tw71]

17 hours ago, John Smith said:

Yes and no. Human buttocks serves as a body heat regulator, then populations who lives into hotter climates tend to resultingly favor a natural proficiency in larger buttocks to better cool down, whilst populations living in colder latitudes tend to be mostly apple-shaped.

Actually, you're just citing one theory of several ....  Seems plausible, definitely -- but may not be the whole story. The three theories I'm aware of (if you disregard ones about it being a genetic trait that developed to aid in selection of a mate) are:

1. Helping to carry children 2. Being a fat reserve during times of famine 3. Being an adaptive physiological feature for female humans living in hot environments because maximizes their bodies' surface-area/volume ratio but keeps enough fat to produce hormones needed for menstruation.
 

[John Smith]

On 6/12/2019 at 1:30 PM, tw71 said:

Actually, you're just citing one theory of several ....  Seems plausible, definitely -- but may not be the whole story. The three theories I'm aware of (if you disregard ones about it being a genetic trait that developed to aid in selection of a mate) are:

1. Helping to carry children 2. Being a fat reserve during times of famine 3. Being an adaptive physiological feature for female humans living in hot environments because maximizes their bodies' surface-area/volume ratio but keeps enough fat to produce hormones needed for menstruation.
 

Indeed.